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A desperate plea for Gopher fans to take a reasoned approach to the QB situation

I want to remove any chance for misinterpretation in this post, so I'm going to tell you exactly what my point is up front. 

The notion that Adam Weber is terrible or unwatchable or that another QB on the roster gives us a better chance to win is 100% wrong.  Adam Weber has been guilty of being horribly inconsistent, but the accusations and charges that he is unwatchable or has no business in a Gopher uniform are unfair and misguided.

I also want to be clear the Adam Weber is not infallible and at times he has earned himself a spot on the bench.  This is not going to be a defense that Adam Weber has been perfect and that all of the problems we have seen with the Gopher offense are the fault of someone else.  He absolutely needs to shoulder much of the blame for what has ailed the Gopher offense.  But as is very often the case in a Madden Football, win-now-or-else and an "I live vicariously through my teams" sporting world; quarterbacks receive too much glory when things go well and take far too much blame when they don't. 

Here are the facts (as I see them)...

Fact #1 - Weber has played very well (AT TIMES) this year.  He played very well more often last year.  For everyone who feels the need to rant and rave about how putrid he was in the first 30 min of the Illinois game, needs to rewatch the second half of that same game and commend him for getting us back into the game (same can be said of Syracuse game).  After a horrendous start to the game by much of the overall roster, Adam Weber played very well and is the primary reason we got ourselves back to within 3 points with just under 10 min left to play.  Here are some of the key plays made late in the 1st half and into the 2nd half, followed by his stats by quarter on Saturday.

  • Q2 - 3rd and 19 - completed 20 yard pass to Tow-Arnett.  2 plays later the Gophers scored their first TD of the game.
  • Q3 - 3rd and 9 - completed 13 yard pass to Da'Jon McKnight, drive continues below.

  • Q4 - 3rd and 24  - completed 25 yard pass to Tow-Arnett, next play Gophers scored second TD of the game.

  • Q4 - the third TD drive - Weber goes 4/4, 55 yards including the 2-pnt coversion to McKnight.

Stats by Quarter

Comp Att % Yds TD INT Sack
Q1 2 7 28.6% 17   1 1
Q2 3 10 30.0% 57     2
Q3 4 6 66.7% 60     2
Q4 5 7 71.4% 87 1   2
1st Half 5 17 29.4% 74
1 3
2nd Half 9 13 69.2% 147 1
4
Total 14 30 46.7% 221 1 1 7

 

Slow start, terrible 1st quarter and a glaring pick-6.  But clearly got better as the game went on and that is a very solid second half, especially when you factor in that he was sacked 7 times.  The point of this is not that Weber is incredible or perfect.  But I believe if you want to have an honest and intelligent conversation about the QB situation for the Gophers you have to acknowledge that he has played well at times (Syracuse 2nd half, Mich St, Cal Q2 and Q3, Northwestern).  Consistency is the issue here, not lack of any ability.

Secondly, there are others to share much of the blame of the offense this year. Brewster following Saturday's loss to Illinois...

"The other 10 guys on offense do their job and we do a good job protecting Adam and our receivers do a good job running routes, Adam's a good football player.  When they don't it's hard for him to be as effective as he'd like to be.  When you look at the quarterback's play, obviously the support of the other 10 guys is goes a long way to determine what type of game he's going to have.  He did a lot of good things today and there were some plays there that were not so good."

The entire offense was bad in the Ohio State game and Weber was probably at his worst in the second half of that game.  But the fact is he played well in the first half.  There were at least 4 well thrown balls that were just plain dropped in that first half, three of them which would have resulted in first downs.  No doubt that gaining three more first downs and keeping drives alive would have made the first half of that game very different.  Weber took the brunt of the blame for this one and it was undeserved. In the second half he completely derailed and should have been benched (inconsistency).  But before that point he got no help from his teammates. 

Looking more broadly than the OSU game, Weber has been hampered by the things I've been complaining about all season.  Very questionable play calling that is predictable at times and bizarre at others, an OL that cannot open running lanes and has allowed the most sacks in the conference, and undisciplined play leading to far too many penalties.  The entire offense, especially Weber, has been slowed by the changing of offensive systems for the second time in three years.  I believe that changing and offense takes a full year before players are comfortable and able to make plays rather than think about what they are supposed to be doing.  Add to that a rookie OC who is learning how to teach an entire system and how to call a game.  This was a recipe for a sluggish offense, many saw it coming and others (like myself) thought that with some experience on the offense we'd be more equipped to make the transition smoothly.  That was not the case.

Fact #3, this isn't a video game.  I love the nit-picking and piling on when things are not going well.  Case in point is the 47 pass play to Decker in the Purdue game.  As you may recall Decker had his man beat by 3-5 yards, Weber throws the deep ball but Decker has to slow down to catch it and is tackled on the 1 instead of walking into the end zone.  Of course the nit-pickers were ticked that it was so severely underthrown and that was exhibit A as to why Weber has no business playing quarterback in the Big Ten.  But this isn't like pushing a button and the ball is automatically going to be in the receivers hands while in stride.  Just because you can do it in Madden doesn't mean it is a simple pitch and catch in real life. 

I encourage you to critically watch other games and you will see that throwing a deep ball in stride is very difficult to do and QBs miss/underthrow/overthrow receivers on a regular basis.  The day after the Purdue game I'm watching the Patriots play whoever they were playing.  Randy Moss runs a deep flag pattern (about 30 yards) and has his man beat easily by 10 yards.  Tom Brady is not rushed, sees Moss and overthrows him for an uncatchable ball.  Even one of the most accurate QBs in the League misses receivers.  Especially in light of the Weber critics this year I have paid close attention to other games at the D1 and NFL level, QB's miss receivers (especially downfield) all the time.  Hitting a receiver in stride on a 30+ yard pass play is clearly an exception rather than the rule.

Finally, and this is the most important thing to grasp, Adam Weber is just plain not going to get benched and it doesn't matter who the coach is, he just wouldn't. Regardless of what the most knowledgeable fan in Gopher Nation believes or wants to believe he will start the two or three remaining games.  And brace yourself for this...barring injury, he'll likely start every game next year.  I know that many of you are going to throw your arms up and declare that if Brewster even thinks about starting Weber over Gray next year he should be fired before the 1st quarter is over.  But it just won't happen.

First and foremost, coaches will go with what they know and who they trust.  I coached basketball at the college level for several years and while I completely understand that it is a different sport and a VERY different level of talent, I learned several things that are true at any level.  One is that coaches will go with who they trust.  Adam Weber has a three year resume under his belt and Brewster, after watching him in 38 games and hundreds of practices knows exactly what he is and is not capable of.  The casual or even passionate fan who is so livid after the first two quarters of the Illini game that they saw nothing positive in the second half; are not nearly well enough informed to make this decision.

Brewster is going to play the QB that best gives him a chance to win.  He sees what goes on each and every day at practice.  And as much as I hate the "trust the coaches at all cost" mentality, there is some truth to it.  Either Gray has not proven that he should be the starter or Brewster wants the Gophers to lose, which seems more likely.  And based on the fact that Weber has a proven track-record, Gray has to actually out-play Weber to oust him.  Statistically over nearly three years of starting Weber is the most prolific quarterback to wear a Gopher uniform.  Say what you want about being a product of a system but Brewster isn't going to ignore this.

Ultimately, I'm not blind, ignorant nor do I think I'm unintelligent.  I can see that Weber has struggled this year and he is an obvious part of the offensive struggles.  But I get irritated that people are not seeing or recognizing that he isn't the ONLY problem and when he does well or when he is the catalyst for the offense turning things around he gets very little credit.  The fact is Weber has been inconsistent this year.  That is his #1 problem. 

Many view this as a lost season.  Since we aren't going to the Rose Bowl, why not play all of the kids, right?  Well, once again this isn't a video game and there isn't a coach in the country who would throw a way a bowl opportunity as it means money for the school, practice time for the kids, boosts his resume and is something he wouldn't choose to deny to his seniors.  The kids who give you the best chance to win will play.  Maybe if you are 3-7 you'd start building for the future, but when you are in the bowl picture and fighting for that better bowl no coach is going to start thinking about 2011.

I should also be clear that I am in no way anti MarQueis Gray.  The kid has a ton of talent and I really am looking forward to him leading the team.  But I just don't think he is capable of out-performing Weber at this stage.  If Weber were truly terrible for games, then yes.  If he were clearly outplaying Weber when he got his small chances, then yes.  But that isn't the case and like it or not, Weber is your Golden Gopher QB.

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All that being said

And very many good points is the fact that Weber is so inconsistent it was more than ever a reason to be benched….Let the kid catch his breath and regroup. He has to be given a break from the confusion that he is living in. The fact is his lack of ability has cost this team games and if GN is correct don’t expect this team to challenge the top teams in the Big 10 until Gray is a Junior and is the starting QB. Next year will be the same as this year and more of last year…bad QB decisions leading to stupid turnovers and long 2nd and 3rd downs that you occasionally overcome but over the long haul of the season you see where it gets you. What kills me is I think that we may lose out on some great recruits because we have a coaching staff that is inflexible and cant make a change. What about starting Weber as a freshman??? We had upperclassmen that could have played QB for MN but the coaches went with the young guy. The experiment is over. Take a page from Sweater Vests book and play your best QB and for now that is Gray from here on out. I was worn out from reading this blog….it was like reading Sid Hartman. Im the biggest homer of all time…but I wont continue to bang my head on the wall and then wonder why my head hurts….in essence that is what the Gophers are doing by continuing to play Weber.

by DallasGopher on Nov 9, 2009 6:38 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

Agree mostly

I do agree that most fans want to point to every bad play of Weber’s and never acknowledge the good. He has been wildly inconsistent and does shoulder some of the blame. Play calling and penalties have hampered the team the most (1st and goal from the 1 last weekend was infuriating). They continually put Weber in bad spots.

That being said, I do think that Gray needs to be used more as a passer. Other than his stint at OSU on the last drive of the game, I would guess that Gray has been asked to run the ball 80% of the time when he touches it. Too predictable and it doesn’t give anyone a chance to see what Gray can do.

I don’t think Weber should be benched, but Gray does need to be given more opportunity to move the offense down field whether than letting Weber fail. Who do I trust with the game on the line? Weber. But Gray should start seeing more consistent action.

by rencito on Nov 9, 2009 7:35 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

First off, well done GN. This post is fantastic.

You’ve touched on many of the reasons why Weber has had struggles this year and what has contributed to Minnesota’s stop-start offense. I’ll give you one more by way of correlation.

Another team I follow was 4-0 until their starting center got injured, first breaking his foot, and then tearing his ACL three plays into the game in which he returned to action. That team is 1-5 since his injuries. It’s not the only reason, but it doesn’t help matters.

It’s not a coincidence. You’ll also notice that the Gophers’ offensive line has had some really poor days since senior C Jeff Tow-Arnett was lost for the season with his leg injury in the Wisconsin game. The rushing attack has had problems against most teams and pass protection has gotten worse, especially 3 of the past 4 weeks.

I’ve never seen a good, consistent QB at the college level who didn’t have at least a competent offensive line in front of him. Last year, Sam Bradford won the Heisman. This year, Oklahoma loses 4 senior starters on their O-line (including Vikings rookie Phil Loadholt), and Bradford probably lost several million dollars as a result.

by JG2112 on Nov 9, 2009 8:36 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

Ehhh.....yes and no.

Adam Weber is the Benjamin Button of college football quarterbacks. He has regressed each season and this year, he just looks totally confused. I will not make an excuse for a 3rd year starter who takes sacks and doesn’t know enough to throw the ball out of bounds. He plays like he’s got a collar on circa “Running Man” whereby if he crosses the line of scrimmage his head will explode. He’s not a leader any more. He still stares down his primary receiver from the snap to the throw. One guy. Unless he’s running for his life, which if you pay attention to his season statistics, is when the “magic” has happened. It’s rarely in a clean drop-back formation and execution.

Yes, his offensive line is HORRIBLE this season. I’ve even heard announcers (Greasy?) comment on how bad they are. They are rotten. So much so that we can’t score on 1st and 1 yard this week…but I digress…Weber has gotten worse and worse. Missing guy’s on 3 yard slant-ins? The lazy out pick-6 this weekend? What was he thinking?

I don’t play Madden, but I played football for 13 years, and I’ve been a fan my entire life…and I pay close attention to the details of a game. Adam Weber has frustrated me this season unlike any QB I can remember. Why? Because he’s a mental mess. Has all the tools necessary to win, but is so confused as QB this season that I am saying to give Gray a shot at getting playing time. He’s the future. This isn’t knee jerk…this is me looking ahead to the Gophers of 2010/2011…full Brewster 3-4 star recruits all over the field, new stadium with some wear and tear, and expectations higher than the god damned Little Caesar’s Bowl in crappy Detroit Michigan.

by jimipig on Nov 9, 2009 8:53 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

I want Adam to succeed

The kid has worked his a## off under new coaches, new coordinators, etc. He has done everything right off the field – especially given the fact that he has an immensely talented backup behind him.
I will continue to give him the benefit of the doubt. But I will not be upset to see Gray in a constant rotation.

by the accomplice on Nov 9, 2009 10:31 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

I look at it as follows

The only 2 things I really blame Weber for are 1. His inability to get on the page with his wide outs and hit them where they can catch it (they share some responsibility here too) and to a certain extent his soberness. In the first half he just kept on throwing deep trying to recreate last week. Again and again and again. It was painful to watch. Some of that is play calling, but all plays have check down throws and they just weren’t made.

I wish that Brewster would actually play 1 QB for an entire series. If he decides he wants to trot Gray out there for a series to made the D see something else, fine, but let each QB get into a rhythm. Enough of this one play crap.

by TheEvilProfessor on Nov 10, 2009 7:11 AM CST reply actions   0 recs

I meant

stuborness…not soberness…I wonder how that got in there. :)

by TheEvilProfessor on Nov 10, 2009 3:38 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Weber

I’m sure Weber is a good kid etc,, however, we are exasperated with the gophers losing games because of poor basic offensive play. The facts are that there are too many penalties, too much confusion, and the qb apparently does not have good peripheral vision, that sense of the rush, pick up the blitz etc. that he needs to succeed at this level. Is the team drilled well on offense? The plays are there, is there good execution? The answer is no. How much pain can a fan accept, year after year of ineptitude, losing games to opponents who execute even with 2nd team backup qb’s (NW last year, Illinois this year). The offense is killing the gophers this year with its mistakes. Will this team ever at least look like winners when they hustle (waddle)? up to the line of scrimmage to begin another backwards drive away from their own goal line. The gopher curse of 1st and goal on the 1 is alive and well. Come on guys, snap to and kick ass.

by bobbyspringfield on Nov 10, 2009 9:12 AM CST reply actions   0 recs

If any of you had to learn three different offenses in four years, I think you would regress as well.

I reasonably blame Weber’s inconsistency on inconsistent offensive schematics. No one can argue that he wouldn’t be much more successful with a familiar offense, stable offense.

"If we got to we're going to crawl in this locker room. And on our back is going to be an axe..."

by buddylee853 on Nov 10, 2009 9:34 AM CST via mobile reply actions   0 recs

And that O-line really needs to hold for him to do his job as well.

"If we got to we're going to crawl in this locker room. And on our back is going to be an axe..."

by buddylee853 on Nov 10, 2009 9:39 AM CST via mobile up reply actions   0 recs

I would agree with that

for a portion of his passes. Some is clearly the WR and QB thinking the route should break differently. But at this point of the season, if you can’t hit a timing route slant, that speaks volumes. When guys are open under coverage for 10 yard gains…and you never get to that point because you throw it long into double coverage, that’s not scheme. That’s decision making. The coaching staff has done Weber no favors. It seems like Brewster switches schemes if he feels like recruits will respond to it favorably instead of playing to his current players strengths.

by TheEvilProfessor on Nov 10, 2009 9:44 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I think there's a happy medium here...

I understand that Weber perhaps deserves the benefit of the doubt based on his experience, and I get that Brewster trusts him. I also agree that the coaching staff hasn’t done Weber any favors this year with the play calling.
But I agree with some of the posts here, mentally, the guy is a mess, and as a third year starter I find that troubling. New offense or not, as a third year starter there are certain things you should see in the game, and he isn’t seeing them.
I agree that benching him and giving the ball to MarQueis is not a good idea… BUT, I think that giving MarQueis more reps, and not just throwing him in for a play here and there, is a good idea.
The fact that Weber gives us “the best chance to win” may or may not be true, I’m not going to argue that. But the weight of the world is on this kid’s shoulders right now.
I think the happy medium is to give MarQueis more snaps but put him and Adam both in a position to make their own bed. There have been a ton of situations this year where MarQueis was brought in on 2nd & 10 after Weber threw an incomplete pass… they run a QB draw with MarQueis, he gets 4-5 yards, and then is pulled. I say give the kid a full series. This gives him some experience, gives Adam a mental break, and relieves at least some of the pressure from Weber. Even if it’s every 3rd series, I think this would help Weber now, and help Gray for the future.

"Don't you want a little taste of the glory... see what it tastes like?"

by jerdogg1 on Nov 10, 2009 9:45 AM CST reply actions   0 recs

Well Thought Out and Written

I still disagree with most of it though including your opening statement (The notion that Adam Weber is terrible or unwatchable or that another QB on the roster gives us a better chance to win is 100% wrong.) After watching Weber play every game this season you cannot say with 100% certainty that Gray would not give us a better chance to win. The fact is that we don’t know one way or another and that is the coaches fault.

Gray has not been given the opportunity to showcase his talent even though there have been ample opportunities to bench Weber going back to the Wisconsin game where nobody would have blamed Brewster. Weber has been good when given ample time, but those games have been few and far between with this o-line. All the more reason to give Gray more chances and use his athletic ability. Brewster chose not to do that to avoid a qb controversy. Well, the controversy is still there because Weber has played poorly most of the season.

This leaves us stuck with trusting Brewster that he is using the qb that gives us the best chance at winning and he does not deserve that trust. Bill Belichek would deserve that trust as he has earned that from fans. Brewster has yet to prove anything and I really hope he succeeds. I am just not willing to give him my blind faith yet, he needs to earn that.

Gray has not helped his chances by fumbling the ball so often. I just do not like it when his chances get cut to almost nothing after a mistake. If we did that with Weber he would have only finished one game this year-MSU. Weber is one of the 3 worst qb’s in the Big Ten this season (imo). This is his 3rd season and I have seen enough that I am ready to move on.

by Narby on Nov 10, 2009 12:04 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

a year ago was he one of the three worst QBs in the conference?

cause the Big Ten coaches thought he was the second best. LINK

This is proof to the point that changing systems is causing more issues than anything else.

what you say here can, and will, be used against you

by GopherNation on Nov 10, 2009 12:41 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

That's one Theory

Another could be that with an underwhelming conference of quarterbacks last year, Weber played well and padded his stats against weak competition in his first seven games of 2008 (with the obvious exception of Ohio State), and was named 2nd team all conference by default. Here are the numbers for his last six games of the 2008 season (including the bowl game against Kansas) in which the Gophs went 1-5:

113 comp
201 att
56% comp %
1149 yards
191.5 yds per game
6 TD
6 INT
67.86 QB rating

A 67.86 QB rating. That is not a typo. What that is, is awful. Yep, there’s your 2nd team All-Big Ten QB all right.

by Jeffrick on Nov 10, 2009 1:30 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I also disagree

You run an excellent blog and you are indeed very intelligent, but I too disagree with your take on Weber. I will concede that the offensive woes are definitely not all his fault, and the blame should be shared by Wonderboy Fisch, Brewster, the offensive line, and the receivers.

However, consistency is NOT his only issue, and he is not and never has been as talented as you make him out to be. Weber cannot throw a timing pattern to save his life. Hitting a receiver in stride on slants, outs, comebacks etc are simply beyond him. Even at the best times (the Michigan State game) he didn’t do it. What he does is throw a pretty good downfield ball, but even that was lacking against Illinois.

On at least two occassions he overthrew Da’Jon deep over the middle when he was in 1-on-1 coverage. Put that ball anywhere near the big kid and he has a chance to make a play. But Weber sails it five yards over his head. Because he can’t throw the timing routes well this offense lives and dies by the big play and if Weber is off or the receivers have a case of the droppsies, we’re screwed.

His decision making is also bad at times, and in that Illinois game even when he had time to throw, he looked jumpy and indecisive (reminds me of a certain QB in green and gold who plays in the next state over).

MarQueis has also never been given a real opportunity. His playing time is SO sparatic he never gets an chance to get in rhythm. If they would just give him a full series in the first half to run a real offense (which Brew promised us after the Ohio State debacle), then we can see whether he’s ready or not. But putting him in once every three series to either run up the gut or hand off is not a real opportunity.

Holy schnikes there’s about nine more things in here I totally disagree on, but bottom line is, I’d love to see Gray get a chance to play a few series at quaterback before we decide he’s not ready.

by Jeffrick on Nov 10, 2009 12:18 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

Hey

I think Gray should get more snaps.

I agree with what has been said about Weber on the positive/excuse side, but regardless his play has allowed Gray’s potential to earn more time. Not Gray himself, but the future and potential.

Most of all though I like the debate on here. There is passion and energy here and sometimes our/your blog is pretty calculated and newsy. Now I am not asking for sensationalism, but nice to see some reasoned and deep Op/Ed going on. Nice work GN.

by InflectionPoint on Nov 10, 2009 1:41 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

Interesting point...

on the news vs op/ed. I hadn’t thought of that before. I definitely do like more debate.

by rencito on Nov 10, 2009 6:51 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Disagree almost entirely

I’m going to end my hiatus with a post on why Adam Weber needs to be benched now.

Maroon and Gold Headquarters: The Daily Gopher

by PJS on Nov 10, 2009 3:26 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

And the sun continues to set in the west

Okay, so the point of the post was that Weber is inconsistent and he can perform at high level — sometimes. Nobody disputes that. His performance last year also proves that. But, I don’t agree that nothing should be done about his poor play. I don’t accept the message that Weber is your starter so deal with it.

Brewster keeps saying he will hold the players accountable, responsible and judge them on performance on key situations. So, what does he do when the players fail him? Are there any consequences? Apparently, not for Weber.

Benching is not only good for the subject player but improves the morale of the team. It can be extremely frustrating, not just for the back-up but other starters, when someone who deserves to get benched keeps playing as if nothing applies to them.

by Garrick on Nov 10, 2009 4:34 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

A valiant attempt by GNation

but I am not buying it. Too lazy to spell out my case. Really enjoyed the commentary above.

by Texas Gopher on Nov 10, 2009 5:17 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

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