Why Gopher fans shouldn't cheer for Wisconsin or Iowa in bowl games
by Jeffrick on Jan 5, 2012 9:00 AM CST
in Gopher Football
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PrintOk so full disclosure: I meant to get this posted last Thursday or Friday. You know, before New Year's Day and the big bowls when the Big Ten fell flat on its face. But because of family commitments, work, and holiday laziness, it didn't happen. Still, a few days after the BCS bowls are done, and we await the national championship Monday, Big Ten fans are licking their wound after their schools got beat on the big stage. As Gopher fans we didn't have a team to root for, but our pride is a bit wounded as OUR conference got its ass kicked. Again. As members of the Big 10, we're inclined to root for our conference brethren this time of year, in a one-for-all and all-for-one mentality where B1G teams winning bowl games is somehow good for Minnesota.
I get that, I really do. I understand why you'd want to cheer for your conference and how it's great when they win and hurts a bit when we lose. But one thing I'll never understand is how Gopher fans can cheer for Wisconsin and Iowa in bowl games...
Last I checked, these were our two biggest, most hated rivals (checking again just to be sure...yep, they still are). The only time I could possibly consider rooting for either of these schools is if it somehow helped Minnesota, but I would hate myself the entire time I had to do it. For some Gopher fans, something changes during the bowl season and they feel obligated to cheer for the Badgers and Hawkeyes because they're in the Big Ten.
For the life of me, I just don't get it. It'd be like cheering for the White Sox in the World Series because they're an AL Central team, UND in the Frozen Four because they're a WCHA team (at least for one more year), the Canucks in the Stanly Cup Finals because they're from the Northwest Division (2012 can't come soon enough so the Wild can get the hell out of that division and back to the Central Norris where they belong!), or the Packers in the Super Bowl because they're from the NFC North. Makes no sense whatsoever in those situations, yet somehow it does for college bowl season? Heck, even in college hoops I'm not cheering for Wisconsin (I'm omitting Iowa because they never make it anymore) in the Big Dance just because they're from the Big 10.
What is it- and I'm really, truly, honestly asking here- for people who do this? How can conference affiliation trump rivalries? And not only does it turn my stomach to even THINK of cheering for Wisconsin or Iowa, but how can you not see that their success in bowls HURTS the Gophers, not helps?!? That's the argument that really baffles me, the one that says "the Big Ten's success in bowl games- and that includes Wisconsin and Iowa- helps Minnesota." Ummm... how is that again? Please explain.
Wisconsin and Iowa winning bowl games doesn't help Minnesota recruit better players- it helps Wisconsin and Iowa recruit better players. And last I checked, Wisconsin doesn't need any more ammunition against the Gophers in recruiting. Iowa? They could use a bowl win or two considering Minnesota beat them this year. The Badgers and Hawkeyes are our two biggest rivals on the field and in recruiting, and them winning bowl games helps them a lot more than it may help the Big Ten, and it doesn't help the Gophers at all.
Again. I love the Big Ten, and I love that the Gophers are apart of it, and it pains me when the B1G struggles in bowl games like they did this year. But no matter how much I might like to think it helps the image or prestige of the conference, as a Gopher fan I cannot and will not cheer for Wisconsin or Iowa in bowl games.
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This whole concept is silly for the professional sports-related reasons you bring up.
The issue cannot be more than, “I’m putting on this bowl game and I need to choose my rooting interests. Therefore, I choose that I want Wisconsin or Iowa to win this game.”
Beyond that, what in the world are people doing? When I turned on the Kraft Fight Hunger Bowl, I just watched the game as if I was watching the Hornets play the Pistons. When Illinois won, my emotions changed zero.
I do like to see a few college football teams win – they include Michigan, Minnesota (alum), Georgia (Mark Richt is a coach worth rooting for), Hamline (alum), Oklahoma State, USC, and Alabama (I am currently a post-grad student at Bama). Beyond that, however, why waste the emotions or rooting interest on a team you hate, or don’t care about, for 3 hours? That’s just unhealthy in my opinion.
To take it a step further, having any kind of emotional reaction to how a conference performs in the bowl arena is just as comical. The B1G always “plays up” so it’s at a disadvantage (Northwestern playing A & M, right? Iowa playing Oklahoma? In the past it’s been even worse for the conference), and the B1G is usually paired with the SEC, a conference whose members in the SEC West routinely sign an extra class worth of players every 3-4 years (how convenient to have 25 extra guys from which to build a team) and have academic requirements roughly equivalent to Detroit’s public school league.
Other than the MNC and the Rose, the bowl season means nothing. They are exhibition games. That makes it even more silly to think you’ve got to root to conference rivals. I wish people would stop traveling to these games and wasting their money on them, so that these independent swindlers would go out of business (seriously, who is the bigger swindler – a Wall Street trader or a bowl CEO?)
Couldn't Agree More
I get that the B1G winning in post-season is an opportunity for us to showcase the best conference in collegiate athletics. It hurts when you go to bowl games against the 4th or 5th best team in the SEC and get spanked. It’s frustrating when a member of your conference has won the Rose Bowl exactly ONCE in the last 12 years. We want to see the B1G successful because we’d like to believe that we’ve played against the highest level of competition in college football during the regular season.
However, Wisconsin could lose EVERY, SINGLE, GAME and I wouldn’t feel a lick of sympathy. The same goes for Iowa. To me, I hope the B1G represents itself well in the post-season, but I don’t want my rivals having any more ammunition against me.
We need to get back to going to bowls. Not just back to bowls, but better bowls than Wisconsin and Iowa. If we lose all of them, I’m sure they won’t feel bad for us.
No that you mention it
I do root for Wisconsin in the big dance, but I think that’s just respect for Bo Ryan. And hate for the ACC and Big Eat.
Otherwise I agree.
How in the world can you respect that whiny SOB?
He’s a good coach, no question. But he is also a crybaby who pouts and screams and stomps his feet like a two year old.
That's not fair to two year olds.
Everyone fails. The successful learn from their failures. I just wish we'd quit giving ourselves so many learning opportunities.
by WhiteSpeedReceiver on Jan 5, 2012 10:58 AM CST up reply actions 1 recs
Every coach does it to some extent.
Not every coach takes it to the extreme he does (see: video from end of MSU game).
Screw work, I have a position to defend
using professional sports is ridiculous—-apples/oranges. Crap, no time. Bottom line, if you guys want to think of the B10 as some sort of Ivy League, so be it. I want the B10 to be the biggest, baddest MF’in conference in the land. Gotta run, to be continued. A rising tide raises all ships.
Let's imagine you are some blue-chipper
You don’t think a conference’s national status comes into play?? The BigEast is a mess right now——how many players are changing their mind bc of that?? You guys are being selfish and putting your personal interests ahead the whole.
We're going to end up in agree to disagree land I think...
…but this debate can be fun so I’ll quickly restate some of my previous points. I don’t see any basis for the “rising tide” thing. Does it play into things? Sure. But so do: playing time, coaching staff, quality of program, offensive/defensive scheme, uniforms, climate, players in the NFL, academic programs, etc. Conference quality is not a huge factor on its own IMO. You don’t hear recruits talk a lot about the conference as THE REASON they went somewhere.
Any good that comes because of “conference image” is outweighed by the negative of our 2 primary rivals (in recruiting, not just on the field) having more success.
I do hear recruits talk about wanting to play in the Big 10.
That is a major factor in guys coming to the Big 10, in my opinion. Do I have examples? No, I just know I’ve read it multiple times.
Or maybe it’s just Minnesota recruits who mention it…because they had no other big 10 offers! Damn it….
Sad, but true statement
Or maybe it’s just Minnesota recruits who mention it…because they had no other big 10 offers!
Wanting to play in the B1G...
…doesn’t necessarily have anything to do with conference strength. They could have grown up around B1G football and it’s the tradition, or the style of play, or the academic quality of the universities.
What I’m trying to say is…I don’t think many recruits go “I’d consider Minnesota except for the fact that the B1G keeps losing Rose Bowls and has a horrible NYD bowl record over the last 2 seasons.” Could that happen? Sure. But I suspect that if such a consideration even enters into a recruits mind at all it is in the context of all the other factors that matter to them about a school.
In other words, if Minnesota and Generic SEC School are considered entirely equal by a recruit I suppose conference perception could break the tie. But I sincerely doubt it happens that much.
Minnesota has plenty of battles to fight in terms of perception and reality that are much more likely to have a tangible impact on recruiting that I don’t see conference perception as a big factor. ESPECIALLY if improving conference perception comes at the expense of better success for our 2 primary on field/recruiting rivals.
Conference taters to recruits because
Of exposure. B1G means every ame in TV, better chance to be scouted.
Winning bowl games doesn’t really change that.
You guys are being selfish and putting your personal interests ahead the whole.
This is also the point where I note that what we as fans want or what we as fans do when it comes to cheering from home during bowl season HAS NO IMPACT on the games. So…yea. Not sure where personal interests are being put ahead of the whole. Unless you think my laughing my ass off when Wisky spiked the ball to lose the game caused the clock to run faster.
The more I think about it, the more I think it's interpretation...
…I want the Big 10 to do well. Do I cheer for Wisconsin? Not really. I don’t clap in my house when they complete a big pass play. I just don’t get angry if they win. I don’t hate when they play well in a big Bowl game. I shrug it off and say “well that makes the big 10 look good”.
Is that defined as “cheering”? I don’t think so. But maybe.
I see professional sports as an awful analogy…though I enjoy your work otherwise! The Packers can rot in eternal hell, always. The Lions are filthy and I will enjoy very little like I will enjoy them losing in the playoffs. Go Bears.
by jimipig on Jan 5, 2012 12:23 PM CST reply actions 1 recs
This is largely my frame of mind.
I want the conference to acquit itself well, but this doesn’t extend to any particular rooting interest in any game.
I usually cheer for B1G teams besides Wisconsin and Iowa
This year, I bought a Ducks shirt and wore my OU shirt to support the slaughter, and it was glorious. We’re not the SEC or Big 12 and have more to hang our hats on than just football, so screw the Badgers and Iowa. There’s enough beer, cheese and methamphetamine in those two states to keep their fan bases engaged, they don’t need any help from us.
When we get the Pig, the Jug and the Axe, we'll have one hell of a picnic
I choose to root against Iowa/Wisconsin
mostly because I enjoy the rivalry and want them to lose every game they play. I don’t have any real hatred or ill-will, but for me it is party of what makes being a sports fan fun. I get to choose some teams to root for, some to root against and then a whole bunch that I don’t care much about.
On the other hand I get tired of the Big Ten having a weaker football reputation so winning some of these big games would have been nice to see. I was kind of rooting for Wisconsin to beat Oregon but then would remind myself that I don’t like the Badgers. I wanted the Big Ten to win and Wisconsin to lose. Was that a win-win or a lose-lose? :)
what you say here can, and will, be used against you The Daily Gopher
You guys cannot have it both ways
you can’t hope Iowa/Wisky loses but also hope for a strong conference national reputation. I am all for the B10 beating the crap out of each other during the regular season but bowl play (or hopefully someday playoff time) we should band together bc it is in everyone’s best interest if the conference does well. I just don’t see how most of you can’t see it. Taken to an extreme, how about if we went 0-10 this bowl season. Jerry Kill comes down to Texas to look for some playmakers and what does he sell them?? You are stuck recruiting players for reasons other than the football challenge—-I go back to my Ivy league statement. I am done with this—-we have much bigger problems now to figure out with the BB program.
Sigh...
Sure you can. No one expects the B1G to go undefeated. If the record were 8-2 are you saying that wouldn’t lend itself to a positive impression? Don’t be silly.
The reason others (inc me) don’t see what you see is that there is nothing substantial to prove your point. Which is fine. It’s your opinion and as I said above, ultimately we’re going to have to agree to disagree I think. But you haven’t shown any concrete reason to convince folks of the certainty you bring to your opinion.
You argument revolves around “football challenge” as if it were the sole thing kids are looking for. Your argument also assumes that bowl records are the only thing that conference strength is based on. The B1G is known and continues to be known as a strong football conference. It is just not know as the best conference in the land. It is not the Ivy Leagues, it is nowhere near that, and to toss that out as a comparison is a straw man (and I think you know it).
I’ve attempted to lay out my logic for why I don’t find your case very persuasive. I don’t expect it to automatically change your mind because I too have nothing concrete to show either. That’s because both of our arguments revolve around the affect on recruiting, an inherently subjective process based on the whims of 17 and 18 year old kids. Asking for “proof” in that process is a fool’s errand. The difference is that you’ve hung your hat on a single thing, “competitveness”, as some overarching truth that all kids look for. I think the reason you find yourself pretty alone in your argument is that most people don’t find this very persuasive because they know that is one of a myriad of factors recruits consider.
Lastly, you still ignore the fact that we as fans don’t have any impact on the competitiveness of the whole conference. So you keep getting your undies in a bunch over…well, frankly, I don’t know what. Apparently we’re all traitors who frustrate you and will doom the Gophers because Montee Ball can’t win football games without our goodwill. That’s pretty silly.
My response verbatim...
I want to see the B1G win as many games as they can, but I’ll be happy just as long as Iowa and Wisconsin lose.
4-6 isn’t the greatest record ever, but I knew the games that we didn’t have a shot in. Nebraska, Penn State, Northwestern, Iowa… The Michigan State game surprised me, because I was expecting them to lose that one, and I predicted that Michigan would beat Virginia Tech (because the ACC is terrible). And the cherry on the top was Wilson’s spike to end the game. If some other team gets into the Rose bowl, I’ll be fine, just as long as it’s not Iowa or Wisconsin. Rivalries are not blind to me during Bowl Season, unlike our SEC brethren, who in most cases will boast and parade themselves on their football dominance.
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